Tesla crashes into parked fire truck, Autopilot blamed again; what we know so far...

Discussion in 'Model S' started by simonalvarez0987, Jan 22, 2018.

  1. simonalvarez0987

    simonalvarez0987 Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2017
    Messages:
    1,044
    #1 simonalvarez0987, Jan 22, 2018
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 25, 2018
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    A Tesla Model S traveling at 65 mph crashed into a stationary fire truck at Interstate 405 on Monday morning. The driver of the vehicle, who was reportedly unharmed by the accident, allegedly claimed that the electric car was on Autopilot when the collision happened.

    Authorities who responded to the scene stated that the driver smashed into the fire truck around 8:30 a.m. local time. While the California Highway Patrol and Culver City Fire Department has confirmed the general details of the incident, authorities explained that they could not confirm if the Tesla Model S had indeed been on Autopilot when it crashed into the stationary truck.

    The firefighters also noted that they could not be sure if the electric luxury sedan slowed down in the moments before it hit the fire truck. Considering the extensive damage to the car, however, it appears like the Model S was moving at a fairly high speed when it collided with the emergency vehicle.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Source: 955529991319560192[/MEDIA]]Culver City Firefighters via Twitter

    In a statement to The Mercury News, Culver City Fire Department battalion chief Ken Powell explained that the accident was quite severe, with the entire front of the Tesla Model S crushed as a result of the impact. Powell further stated that the driver of the vehicle was able to walk away from the accident unharmed. The battalion chief even noted that while the driver of the Model S seemed shaken, he showed no signs of any injuries and refused treatment.

    The accident was announced to the public by the Culver City Fire Department through its official Twitter account, where the update was met with strong reactions from members of the microblogging platform. Many Tesla and non-Tesla owners, for one, noted that the incident might have been caused by driver error. After all, Tesla’s Autopilot system is an advanced driver-assistance system that does not provide fully autonomous features. Thus, the driver of the ill-fated Model S could have intervened when the electric car was heading into the parked fire truck.

    Since the debut of Autopilot, Tesla has strongly urged drivers that the system is only intended to be used as a way to aid the driver. The Model S also has several fail-safes in its software system, with the electric car engaging numerous visual and auditory warnings when it senses too little interaction from the driver.



    The Tesla Model S is one of the safest vehicles on the road. Due to the construction of the vehicle and the absence of a gas-powered engine, the luxury electric sedan has a large crush zone in its front. Its low center of gravity also prevents the vehicle from rolling over easily. Despite being a safe vehicle, however, the Model S and its Autopilot system met with tragedy in 2016, when Tesla owner Joshua Brown collided with a truck near Williston, Florida in a fatal accident. Nevertheless, Brown’s family eventually released a statement, saying that they do not blame the car for the loss of Joshua’s life, as there was a vital window of time when the Model S owner was not able to notice the truck his car was heading into.

    Article: Tesla crashes into parked fire truck, Autopilot being blamed once again
     
  2. JordanWilliamson

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2017
    Messages:
    118
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    What the hell are people doing in their car? You would see a fire truck hundreds of meters in advance, autopilot doesn't disable your brakes and steering wheel.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. Ric

    Ric New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2016
    Messages:
    6
    Unanswered questions w/r this article: was this an AP-1 or AP-2 vehicle? Was AP even active at the time? Which rev of s'ware was installed? Until these and many others have answers, this is just another sensationalized article about something that occurs thousands of times a week in cars built by every manufacturer on the planet. Yes, indeed...what in hell are people doing in their car??!
     
  4. patrick40363

    patrick40363 New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2017
    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    Cali
    I hope the driver got a ticket. You are responsible for driving the car.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  5. Nic Betts

    Nic Betts New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2016
    Messages:
    1
    Please tell me someone checked to see if there was an Orange in the car. For those that don't understand that - good.
    If he did hack autopilot then he is an idiot. I use AP2 everyday on the busy Rt2 into Boston and it is fine with the stop and go traffic and the idiots who cut in when there isn't a space.
     
  6. vdiv

    vdiv Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2016
    Messages:
    75
    #6 vdiv, Jan 23, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2018
    Periodically tugging the steering wheel is not an indication that one is paying attention to the road ahead. Conversely not tugging on it is not an indication that they are not paying attention or don't have their hand on the steering wheel. This was a failure to regulate the speed of the vehicle or slow down to a stop, not a failure to steer. Based on the photo in that section there wasn't anywhere for him to steer, but to only stop. Perhaps he could have changed lanes earlier to avoid the emergency vehicles.

    Looking at the long shadows the sun was low and may have blinded the camera, so it was up to the radar to detect the still obstacle. Given that at highway speed there seems little chance that the car would stop by itself.
     
  7. J.Taylor

    J.Taylor Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2017
    Messages:
    460
    Location:
    Canada
    Looks like Tesla will eventually have to make their crash avoidance system active at all times unless deliberately turned off by the driver *(note that it should not turn off when the brake pedal it touched, this should require accessing a sub-menu on the computer so it cannot be disabled easily)..
     
  8. Mark Schaffer

    Mark Schaffer Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2017
    Messages:
    102
    When the accident happened would have been some time prior to the video we see above. I doubt "blindness" of sensors had anything to do with this.
     
  9. vdiv

    vdiv Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2016
    Messages:
    75
    The accident happened at approx. 8:30am, sunrise at Culver City was at 6:56am. We cannot exclude the possibility, we know it can and has been a factor.
     
  10. Michael Russo

    Michael Russo Administrator

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2016
    Messages:
    1,952
    Location:
    Pau, France
    Here’s the answer... D.U.I. :rolleyes:
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...excuse-for-his-dui-crash-the-car-was-driving/
    Autopilot is NOT FSD and does not relieve the driver to pay attention at all times!
    Happy to set the record straight.
     
  11. latiadeegan84

    latiadeegan84 New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2017
    Messages:
    1
    Interesting.. that doesn\'t seem like a crash with 65 mph, but i also don\'t see skid marks on the road in the picture... If the car was moving at 65 mph before the crash, something must have slowed it down to at least under 35 mph. for the damage to make sense.
     
  12. simonalvarez0987

    simonalvarez0987 Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2017
    Messages:
    1,044
    #12 simonalvarez0987, Jan 25, 2018
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 25, 2018
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    All eyes are on Tesla once more, after a Model S traveling at highway speeds crashed into a parked fire truck in Culver City, California earlier this week. The collision, which allegedly happened while the car was on Autopilot, has incited renewed debates, criticisms, and an upcoming government probe on Tesla and its evolving driving-assist software.

    As more details about the accident emerge, here is a brief discussion on the latest and most pertinent information relating to the recent Model S collision.

    The accident

    As we stated in a previous report, the Tesla Model S was traveling at 65 mph on Interstate 405 on Monday morning when it crashed into a stationary fire truck. The emergency vehicle was parked on the road after being deployed to a separate accident in the area.

    The driver of the electric car was able to walk away unharmed from the accident. Upon being questioned by the authorities, the Model S driver stated that the vehicle was on Autopilot when it collided with the parked fire truck. Tesla released a brief statement on Monday, stating that Autopilot is intended only to be used by an attentive driver.

    More details emerge

    As the online forum community continued to debate about the benefits and risks of Tesla’s Autopilot software, a member of the r/TeslaMotors subreddit who claimed to know the driver of the crashed Model S spoke up and provided some details about the accident. According to the Redditor, the Model S was traveling behind a pickup truck with Autopilot engaged. Due to the truck’s size, the Tesla’s driver was unable to see beyond the vehicle in front.

    “The driver of the Tesla is my dad’s friend. He said that he was behind a pickup truck with AP engaged. The pickup truck suddenly swerved into the right lane because of the firetruck parked ahead. Because the pickup truck was too high to see over, he didn’t have enough time to react.” notes mikhpat.

    [​IMG]Tesla Model S crashes into a stationary firetruck [Credit: Culver City Fire Department via Twitter]

    Tesla’s Autopilot system allegedly did not have enough time to react while driving at 65 mph. The driver stated that the Model S’ emergency braking system might have activated moments before the car hit the emergency vehicle, but he could not be certain, according to mikhpat‘s statement.

    “As for the 65mph detail, the braking system could’ve intervened before the collision, but there’s no way he could tell.”

    The impact was strong enough to push the steering wheel two feet into the cabin, however. The Model S driver had some minor cuts and bruises from the accident but was otherwise unharmed. According to the Redditor, the driver admits that he was at fault for not paying close attention to the road. The Model S owner also refused to blame Tesla for the accident.

    While it’s still unconfirmed if Tesla’s Autopilot suite, including Traffic-Aware Cruise Control and Autosteer, was activated at the time of the accident, Tesla’s Model S Owner’s Manual warns of a similar scenario that would not be detected by the driving-assist system.

    According to the About Drive Assistance section of the owner’s manual:

    The warning appears to mimic the exact situation being described by Redditor mikhpat.

    The investigations begin

    As the online forum community exploded amidst heated debates on who is to blame for the recent Model S collision, the US National Transportation Safety Board announced that it is sending two of its investigators to California to study the crash. According to the NTSB, the investigators will be examining both “driver and vehicle” factors in Monday’s accident.

    By Tuesday, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration announced that it is also sending a team of investigators to California to evaluate the recent accident, as well as to assess any “lessons learned” from the crash, as noted in a Bloomberg report. The NHTSA did not specify which team of investigators it was sending to California, but expectations are high that the regulating body would be deploying its Special Crash Investigations unit.

    Article: Tesla Model S firetruck crash in California: What we know so far
     
    • Informative Informative x 3
  13. Michael Russo

    Michael Russo Administrator

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2016
    Messages:
    1,952
    Location:
    Pau, France
    @simonalvarez0987 , had you seen the Washington Post article about the reported DUI? See my post #10 above.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  14. simonalvarez0987

    simonalvarez0987 Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2017
    Messages:
    1,044
    Ah, this is quite interesting, actually. It turns out the DUI mentioned in the WaPo article was referring to the Model S incident on Bay Bridge earlier during the weekend, so we're not entirely sure if the driver of the Model S that crashed into the firetruck was also a bit, erhm, distracted. :D
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  15. Michael Russo

    Michael Russo Administrator

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2016
    Messages:
    1,952
    Location:
    Pau, France
    Oh, my bad, I missed that these were two separate incidents. Hence my ‘informative’ rating... ;)
    I was hesitating with ‘funny’ ‘cause if your closing statement! :D
    As to cause, the investigation should speak to it. Facts Matter!
     
  16. Ric

    Ric New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2016
    Messages:
    6
    Of course...goes without saying. Interestingly, a reminder from the owner's manual has been highlighted by several folks, emphasizing the fact that, especially under the circumstance of following a moving vehicle that suddenly moves to another lane and reveals a stationery object, the AP software interprets the object as something to ignore. According to subsequent reports attributed to the owner, that is exactly the (very rare) circumstance he experienced, and he takes responsibility.
     
  17. 2fatpugs

    2fatpugs New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2017
    Messages:
    12
    Location:
    Fremont
    I\'m actually glad to see these types of serious but non fatal crashes. Even if it is the driver\'s fault, Tesla will learn something from it and possibly make all Tesla\'s more safe.
     
    • Like Like x 3

Share This Page